#Heisenbeans Genetics

[Goats]

That’s not a good thing If you want customers coming back more often

 

[Old ST1R]

400w cooltube on one side and a 600w white led on the other.

Holy shit! I thought my 600 watt HID was overkill! You don’t have any excess light issues?

 

[Cob_nUt]

Rodeleization is not an induced effect. It's just the result of a female at the end of her life.
The genetic makeup of a plant does not become altered in the pollen that's produced because a female was reversed. You inducing the plant. Something it never would have done on it's own without chemicals. It's no more likely to produce a hermie than if a Male was used.
The makeup is passed from the plant in its DNA same way sex is determined. You can breed that trait out of plants by selecting females that will not hermie no matter what. It's always the hardest ones to reverse that produce the least amount of pollen

This was my point.One is a natural process.The other is man induced.

 

[Bodyne]

Holy shit! I thought my 600 watt HID was overkill! You don’t have any excess light issues?

nope, only if they get too close to the light and I keep em close, but not too close. Only way to rock a small tent with good air movement and plenty of light, jmho and jme. Got a decent fan I use as exhaust with the scrubber and a cheap inline for intake.

 

[Cob_nUt]

Sucks that the edit window is so short.This is what I was trying to add^

Also,the hermie comment was in reference that trait,that I believe is in all canna cultivars.Some not so dominant as others as they have been "worked".If you let a plant go past its due date to get nanners,IF the parents or grandparents had the trait in them,theres always the possibility it can be passed.Same way with a reversed gal.If the trait is in her lineage somewhere it is possible it can be passed on.

Popping nanners due to Rodelization is different than a "hermie" In my opinion.

Stress caused sacs ie light leaks, environmental conditions etc..are different than a "hermie".
IMO a line is weak if these factors cause sacs to grow.

True hermies grow both.


Damn I deleted the pic of my first true hermie male.

 

[Old ST1R]

nope, only if they get too close to the light and I keep em close, but not too close. Only way to rock a small tent with good air movement and plenty of light, jmho and jme. Got a decent fan I use as exhaust with the scrubber and a cheap inline for intake.

How close do you keep the 400 w HID?

 

[PosenOS2.0]

There are two different "arguements" here. One is rodeleization or some spelling,which is natural...survival instinct.One is outside forced induced s hormone related process to induce reversal.Internal manipulation of the hormonal level.

Both work.The propensity of "hermies" is greater in one process than the other.

I can live with that as an accurate statement. and I know that if you have a plant that really freakes the fuck out with a little light stress that it's not one that should be normally bred with. And you might stand a greater chance of getting hermies with late cycle, that's Possible. But considering that people run late cycle fems all the time without any problems it's debatable. I've seen problems with plants grow out from all kinds of plants.

I'm certainly not saying that late cycle is the best way, but I do know that it's been used to create some of the best smoke ever and if people want to argue with success they can have at it.

 

[Heisen]

Ok here's the last shot with wedding cake pollen.
I'm doing something a little different. I have a wedding pie that is ready as fuck



And here's the wc pollen. Well see in 4 days how it went. I'm doing 1 dust and that's it.

 

[PosenOS2.0]

Rodeleization is not an induced effect. It's just the result of a female at the end of her life.
The genetic makeup of a plant does not become altered in the pollen that's produced because a female was reversed. You inducing the plant. Something it never would have done on it's own without chemicals. It's no more likely to produce a hermie than if a Male was used.
The makeup is passed from the plant in its DNA same way sex is determined. You can breed that trait out of plants by selecting females that will not hermie no matter what. It's always the hardest ones to reverse that produce the least amount of pollen

I don't want to argue about anything on your site. And if you are really sure that it's not any more likely to produce hermies by inducing them with silver then breeding males, then breeding S1 to S1 should be fine right? That would be one sure way to find out if using silver doesn't increase chances of hermies wouldn't it?

Has anyone bred S1's to S1's without them ending up hermie prone? If so then I am wrong and silver is somehow fundamentally different. If you can't do that though, then something else is going on.

 

[Heisen]

I can live with that as an accurate statement. and I know that if you have a plant that really freakes the fuck out with a little light stress that it's not one that should be normally bred with. And you might stand a greater chance of getting hermies with late cycle, that's Possible. But considering that people run late cycle fems all the time without any problems it's debatable. I've seen problems with plants grow out from all kinds of plants.

I'm certainly not saying that late cycle is the best way, but I do know that it's been used to create some of the best smoke ever and if people want to argue with success they can have at it.

Even a blind squirrel can find a nut. Dont mean he wants to be blind.

 

[Bodyne]

How close do you keep the 400 w HID?

within 18-24 inches, as close as I can without it burnin or bleachin

 

[Heisen]

I don't want to argue about anything on your site. And if you are really sure that it's not any more likely to produce hermies by inducing them with silver then breeding males, then breeding S1 to S1 should be fine right? That would be one sure way to find out if using silver doesn't increase chances of hermies wouldn't it?

Has anyone bred S1's to S1's without them ending up hermie prone? If so then I am wrong and silver is somehow fundamentally different. If you can't do that though, then something else is going on.

Your still missing the point, S1 to S1 makes no difference, Its the tendencies entrapped and locked in the plant that matters. Not sure what your not grasping about that. A late stage hermie plant is a HERMIE plant. wether it does from low light levels , interrupted light, bad nutrients, Its a stress response that requires the plant to reproduce without a male. Its a genetic blessing for plants that arent meant to be smoked but survive. We chemically block the etheylene that makes a female a female. She grows male flowers. No matter or not if she
was born to do so she is going to grow male sacks because she has to. Its a common misconception that S1s are gonna hermie no matter what because its a self pollination. That is 100 percent bullshit. If you take a plant that absolutely will NOT toss a nut at any stage and use its own pollen to make seeds those seeds are as stable as being hit with a male. WHY? because the plant NEVER had hermie tendencies in it to begin with.
Late stage fems IMO is a lazy ass way to make fems and people that cant reverse a female correctly can get away with it. All they are doing is inserting hermie genetics into the gene pool.
Why do you think females like GG4 and other bag seed femz are hermie prone? because they came from a plant that hermied. Its a risk some people are willing to take to find a fire ass keeper. But people still use stable males to make F1s of those moms. Yes there are plenty of offspring that wont herm. But there is still the risk when using those genetics. Bottom line is hermie tendency is passed on just like other traits. If it wasnt than we may as well just toss all our seeds into the same cup because were all looking for something particular from a particular cross. Unfornutely hermie genes go along for the ride when either of the parents have it.

 

[PosenOS2.0]

Your still missing the point, S1 to S1 makes no difference, Its the tendencies entrapped and locked in the plant that matters. Not sure what your not grasping about that. A late stage hermie plant is a HERMIE plant. wether it does from low light levels , interrupted light, bad nutrients, Its a stress response that requires the plant to reproduce without a male. Its a genetic blessing for plants that arent meant to be smoked but survive. We chemically block the etheylene that makes a female a female. She grows male flowers. No matter or not if she
was born to do so she is going to grow male sacks because she has to. Its a common misconception that S1s are gonna hermie no matter what because its a self pollination. That is 100 percent bullshit. If you take a plant that absolutely will NOT toss a nut at any stage and use its own pollen to make seeds those seeds are as stable as being hit with a male. WHY? because the plant NEVER had hermie tendencies in it to begin with.
Late stage fems IMO is a lazy ass way to make fems and people that cant reverse a female correctly can get away with it. All they are doing is inserting hermie genetics into the gene pool.
Why do you think females like GG4 and other bag seed femz are hermie prone? because they came from a plant that hermied. Its a risk some people are willing to take to find a fire ass keeper. But people still use stable males to make F1s of those moms. Yes there are plenty of offspring that wont herm. But there is still the risk when using those genetics. Bottom line is hermie tendency is passed on just like other traits. If it wasnt than we may as well just toss all our seeds into the same cup because were all looking for something particular from a particular cross. Unfornutely hermie genes go along for the ride when either of the parents have it.

My point is that since hitting them with silver doesn't stress them out and make them hermie prone at all and that they ARE exactly like males it would in fact make me 100% wrong that S1's being bred to other S1's creates a problem. This would mean you can breed S1's to S1's which would be cool. I've personaly never seen anything but problems when people do that, so since it's not a problem with silver then obviously silver is totally different. The two things go together, is what I'm saying.

It's always been my assumption that this is something to be avoided even with silver and it's been my personal experience that with other forms of S1's that this always leads to problems, either a big decline in potency or hermie's, I've said this before a few pages back.

Since Silver isn't the same at all, then you shouldn't have any issue and you can breed your S1's to each other, which is cool for everyone right?

I learned something new and I can't wait to see these new strains coming out from S1 to S1.

 

[macsnax]

I believe the term left out here is "genetic drift". I'm not going to join the debate on which method this and that. But when fems go wonky the second or third generation its because of genetic drift, not silver particles.

 

[macsnax]

The silvers effect is only short term, given enough time plant the will revert back to its female expression. If it's not too beat up anyway.

 

[Heisen]

My point is that since hitting them with silver doesn't stress them out and make them hermie prone at all and that they ARE exactly like males it would in fact make me 100% wrong that S1's being bred to other S1's creates a problem. This would mean you can breed S1's to S1's which would be cool. I've personaly never seen anything but problems when people do that, so since it's not a problem with silver then obviously silver is totally different. The two things go together, is what I'm saying.

It's always been my assumption that this is something to be avoided even with silver and it's been my personal experience that with other forms of S1's that this always leads to problems, either a big decline in potency or hermie's, I've said this before a few pages back.

Since Silver isn't the same at all, then you shouldn't have any issue and you can breed your S1's to each other, which is cool for everyone right?

I learned something new and I can't wait to see these new strains coming out from S1 to S1.

Opinions is basically what you have, Saying you have seen nothing but problems when "people" do that but you have no personal experience beyond what you heard from the talking heads. Intersex is a trait, Because you cross a plant into itself doesnt make it develop a trait out of thin air, It doesnt make up its own DNA when that process takes place, It follows the same code as if it were two different plants. Why you think S1s make hermies because of the process is understandable, BUT majority of S1s made have been using clone onlys that came from bag seed or accidental hermies, So your basically combining 2 hermie prone plants together instead of 1 thats not in a cross. If the plant is solid and doesnt throw stress related balls than it will most likely be OK. But the process is not what causes it. Intersex is already imprinted. I have a few S1s being made that will NEVER throw balls like the banana cookies. IT just wont. I can flip the plant back to veg and back to flower and it wont throw no balls, take it till it dies in the pot and never a ball. Making S1s with it will give solid offspring, Now if i crossed it to the glue it would have a higher chance of having hermie offspring than the S1s,

 

[Heisen]

The silvers effect is only short term, given enough time plant the will revert back to its female expression. If it's not too beat up anyway.

I disagree, I can show you pics of 4 plants right now that once reversed never went back, I just put a half dead one in the trash. If you hit them hard before the flip and stay at it the effects build up in the plant. Once its all reversed they just keep going, Ive seen branches that werent sprayed right try and go back but if you reverse the whole plant its over. Bitch is all out kate jenner

 

[macsnax]

I'll have to believe you there. I'm just going by what I've learned recently, but I've also been researching STS. Less applications could be a differential. I'm actually going to be reversing my first few here soon. I'm sure it's different than it looks on paper

 

[Heisen]

I'll have to believe you there. I'm just going by what I've learned recently, but I've also been researching STS. Less applications could be a differential. I'm actually going to be reversing my first few here soon. I'm sure it's different than it looks on paper

lol yeah man its a fukin art. Ive seen multiple failures with it. I put up a good video last night.

 

[macsnax]

M

I'll have to believe you there. I'm just going by what I've learned recently, but I've also been researching STS. Less applications could be a differential. I'm actually going to be reversing my first few here soon. I'm sure it's different than it looks on paper

Didn't mean to quote myself, lol. I'll have to check your video out.