Breeding with feminized seeds ?

chuckbucket

Budtender
i only breed with fem seeds if i stress test the plant and it doesnt herm. and even then, ill only cross plants that came from fem seeds with plants that came from reg seeds. never fem to fem. and i dont make fem seeds with plants that came from fem seeds. if im making fem seeds the parents have to come from reg seeds. i have always done it this way and i have zero proof that it actually has any benefit.
 

Gweedo

Grow God
Im in the dark a bit on this subject as well, im wondering about genetic variances in s2 vs s1 seeds, say i pollinated some mendo s1s with selfed pollen for an s2 if you hit multiple ladies from the same batch will they all be the same or will they have slight pheno differences??? Dumb question maybe but had to ask lol
 

Uncle Romulus

madman, scholar
Site Supporter
i only breed with fem seeds if i stress test the plant and it doesnt herm. and even then, ill only cross plants that came from fem seeds with plants that came from reg seeds. never fem to fem. and i dont make fem seeds with plants that came from fem seeds. if im making fem seeds the parents have to come from reg seeds. i have always done it this way and i have zero proof that it actually has any benefit.
I like your handle. Chuckbucket.. classic!
 

Oreguhnism

Trimmer
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Also it might help to know what you want to accomplish...as for most cases, reversing or selfing is used to narrow the gene pool and is usually used in some combination to promote homogenous seeds imho....regular breeding is usually to widen a genepool, so short of that, I see nothing wrong with either method even rhodelized fems too, aka c99, ogk, sour d, zkittlez, cookies, etc......

Also, just a side note, i have a few close friends growing and breeding hemp commercially. One is a big player, running out a million seeds + right now, and will not breed with a male. Although reversing can still produce Y chromosomes.....
 

Bud Jones

Trimmer
My goal is simple .. To breed a hardy , mold resistant strain for outdoor purposes ... I have a Cannalope haze cut that got zero mold and finished early .. So my plan was to cross her with a Chem variant to bring up the potency , than bx to the mom . Also eying Kosher Kush , those are all fems currently , hence the question about fem seeds ..
 

Rooted

Plant whisperer
My goal is simple .. To breed a hardy , mold resistant strain for outdoor purposes ... I have a Cannalope haze cut that got zero mold and finished early .. So my plan was to cross her with a Chem variant to bring up the potency , than bx to the mom . Also eying Kosher Kush , those are all fems currently , hence the question about fem seeds ..
Ok so cut is fem seed fem. Reverse neccesary to breed. You want to grow out seed to know what your hitting honestly Then rev one of them once you know you have a solid fem from seed. I would reverse a cut from the cut you have so start there cut cuts. Pick your seed. Grab a snickers. But in end you can do it. No real issues. Just time.
 

Bud Jones

Trimmer
Ok so cut is fem seed fem. Reverse neccesary to breed. You want to grow out seed to know what your hitting honestly Then rev one of them once you know you have a solid fem from seed. I would reverse a cut from the cut you have so start there cut cuts. Pick your seed. Grab a snickers. But in end you can do it. No real issues. Just time.
Is Silver Thiosulfate the best route for reversal ?
 

Rooted

Plant whisperer
Is Silver Thiosulfate the best route for reversal ?
Theres arguments as to cs or sts being better.
I’m also wondering if I’m using a feminized female and hit it with male pollen , would there be missing alleles as a result ?? I personally haven’t attempted this so I’m curious . I don’t want to waste time if it’s a bad idea ..
No. Its all good. Be reg seed. Might need stabilizing(inbreeding n hunting ) if you want uniform phenos. Will not be hermie or anything prone if the fem was from stable seed
most fem seed is pretty stable on that or theyd be kicking herms everywhere n noone would buy em.

For reversal its debated. Cs is non toxic but more work n might not reverse . Sts is toxic.
 

Rivendell

Trimmer
I think you are overthinking this way too much. Make some seeds, grow them, see the results. No different than any other way of breeding, results could be stellar and could also be junk. Personally I have made plenty of seeds from a fem seed mom and a reg seed dad, they came out just fine. Fem to fem, I just try to avoid too much inbreeding as you can quickly lose the vigor and robust nature of a more open gene pool.

Totally un asked for piece of advice from someone that personally made a cross for outdoor in the north east where the early finish was super important. Chem hybrids finish very late outdoor for me, and I think you would struggle to keep the early finish if you use a Chem. I would recommend either sourcing a local trusted outdoor clone to cross your strain with or sourcing a outdoor strain in reg seed form to use for your cross. Find two females you really like in the F1 or F2 generation and cross them for your fem outdoor seeds. There will still be variation, but if both parents are early finishers you have a much better chance for that trait to be present across the board.

Have fun!
 
My goal is simple .. To breed a hardy , mold resistant strain for outdoor purposes ... I have a Cannalope haze cut that got zero mold and finished early .. So my plan was to cross her with a Chem variant to bring up the potency , than bx to the mom . Also eying Kosher Kush , those are all fems currently , hence the question about fem seeds ..
I say chuck that pollen! Keep in mind, until you've stabilized some traits, what some of the seeds present this year
I think you are overthinking this way too much. Make some seeds, grow them, see the results. No different than any other way of breeding, results could be stellar and could also be junk. Personally I have made plenty of seeds from a fem seed mom and a reg seed dad, they came out just fine. Fem to fem, I just try to avoid too much inbreeding as you can quickly lose the vigor and robust nature of a more open gene pool.

Totally un asked for piece of advice from someone that personally made a cross for outdoor in the north east where the early finish was super important. Chem hybrids finish very late outdoor for me, and I think you would struggle to keep the early finish if you use a Chem. I would recommend either sourcing a local trusted outdoor clone to cross your strain with or sourcing a outdoor strain in reg seed form to use for your cross. Find two females you really like in the F1 or F2 generation and cross them for your fem outdoor seeds. There will still be variation, but if both parents are early finishers you have a much better chance for that trait to be present across the board.

Have fun!
Agreed, good advice. I tend to like the quick outdoor finishers when making a cross, where almost all are done by late September with the outliers tending to be semi-autoish and late August finishers.

A bird in hand is worth two moldy ones in the bush or something like that.
 
chuckbucket and [B]Rivendell[/B] laid out most all of it. chuckbuckts way of doing shit is tried and true so you can't go wrong doing it. with that said it used to be taboo and with some as stated still is to use a feminized mom to breed with. Yet, it has been done quite a bit in the last decade. so, how you feel about do doing that is personal preference and you can always go both routes and maybe learn something from it.

dude already touched on matching your chosen strain to a better candidate for outdoors. yet, the kicker is you very well might not get that chosen strain to be dominant at all in the first cross. with that if your chosen strains resistance is more important than it's actual genetic makeup pure than you can likely get good smoke from a good matching male. the best match would be a transparent male that allows mom to represent strongly as much as possible.

might take you awhile to select your males and than test them but i'm pretty sure you already know it's not going to be too easy but u can always hit the jackpot with your match.

i had a project in mind just to have them finish by oct. 1st. at the latest. so certain strains i was/am looking at to make that route easier imho. semi/full auto's like short term amnesia, might mite, mighty freeze, auto ak47, SR60, freezland, timewarp and a few other strains hard to get like pukeberry = perfect but can't source that cut anymore. i do have a cross to look for puke dom's though. dynamite, blue dynamite and quite a few other early cultivars slip my mind now as sual.
 

KMOG

Insane Grower
Assuming clones like gg4, chem dawg, gsc, etc....pretty much all the hype strains are bagseed of some type and also from herms. The idea of breeding with fems and otherwise unstable plants /genetics seems to be totally acceptable across the market. Even the guys that only breed regs that are using those moms at somepoint, right?
 
i pointed that out in my post only thing is i didn't choose to name the cuts/strains. that's why i said people are doing it while some remain like chuckbucket and refuse to do it. as long as you get the results that's all that really matters. some folks will and some folks won't. it's a plant affected by many variables and whether it herms and when it herms in flower matters now less than it used to. again covered above.

the fact that some herm prone moms throw good kids is what it is. while other do the same but those kids will throw out a few balls but not enough for most to kill/chop her.
like the regular strains that when u go past flowering awhile will try to survive and make pollen sacs. it's all a part of what hasn't changed much. it's only that some folks criteria has changed imho while other remain the same. just how i look at it.
 
When you use feminized seed stock as breed stock, the results can vary.

If the feminized stock had some hermie tendencies to begin with, it can pass that on.

If the feminized stock didn't have hermie tendencies, not likely to pass on what it doesn't have genetically.

I've used fem stock many times to receive male pollen and sometimes to receive feminized pollen from reversed females, haven't noticed any higher incidences of hermies in the offspring, but admittedly not done with a large scale scientific approach.

If I consider something a genetic hermie, I trash it, with no regrets.

If I consider something susceptible to "going hermie" due to environmental stuff like light bleed, I note that and probably shy away from popping more of them, unless I've run it several times before without issue and I've fixed the environmental cause.

Your mileage may vary.
 
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