State of LEDs, OSRAM, SAMSUNG, CREE, PHILIPS, ETC

ChiefRunningPhist

Drunk on Knowledge
Thanks. Ok, think i'm done for now:
Meanwell claim 98% efficiency, whilst its proven more like 92% at higher wattages and lower lifespan, which is why I stated in one of my earlier posts if you going +300W you are better off getting inventronics as they are actually more efficient at higher wattage even though they state less.

Efficiency is usually rated/marketed at a specific load point. e.g. 50% load on the driver it is 98% efficient, but at 75-100% load is is closer to 90-92% efficient. I do not believe it is wrong for meanwell to rate their driver at 98% peak efficiency, NOTE at 50% load. Whilst remaining in a certain range e.g. above 90% do be given a certain rating of efficiency. Normal PC PSU's also have a rating system, bronze, silver, gold, platinum, titanium rated efficiency, I hope that rings a bell. Those ratings also mean the PSU efficiency, consistency, stability, reliability safety features never drops below a certain percentage from 0-100% load and meat the respective criteria standards, which is how they receive their ratings. There are standards for efficiency ratings for power supplies like PC PSUs but i'm not sure if the same applies to LED drivers or if they fall under a different regulating/certification authority or what the requirements are for using a rating on the product, technically, meanwell is not lying about its efficiency, but it also does not give full truth as it depends on the customer's usage of their products and your experience may vary depending on your usage.

Where inventronics may be using an average co-efficient to rate their drivers.
I hope this answers some questions or correct some statements made.

I purposefully withhold information in the hopes people would actually go out and do a bit more research. In some cases I may not know (highly likely), but then I will say I do not know, or I am not sure.

I in no way intended my quote of your words to disprove or shoot you down in any way. I did feel the direction of and discussion of said topic thread needed to be discussed in more depth thus a well deserved own thread. I also do not intend to come off as sarcastic, smarter or act in any way in which to offend any said person or company or whomever they represent.



If I had more time to spend on the forums I'd post better responses which took more time to explain. The fact that you are asking all these questions is a very good thing because it opens up discussion on topics never really discussed when it comes to what light to buy. Many people see lights and setups in youtube shows, or youtube grow influencers if you can call them that. I do feel with little effort and actual interest of communities that want to grow better together, knowledge is a powerful thing.

The more you know the easier you see through the bullshit and straight up marketing campaigns. I've gone to expos where people were supposed to explain how to grow your the best from seed to harvest. The whole time the chump was on stage he was upselling all his products on his online store and didn't explain a damn thing to +50 year olds that wants to grow his/her own medicine also attending the same expo as everyone else. Everything second or third sentence the "solution" to something is "you can buy x y z on our store for a b c". At no point did he explain on stage anything relating to the topic they claimed to be there for.

Not, how to guarantee germination of your bought seeds, to taking care of it during seedling stage. (if you smoke cigarettes wash your hands and where unpowdered sterile gloves handling the plant as they can get infected by a tabacco virus). Nothing, not soak the seed in de-chlorinated water for 12-24-48 hours. or scuffing a seed, or possibly a few drops of H peroxide, absolutely zero help to cannabis community. I do not assume the next person know as much as me or ever assume I know more than the next but I do have an urge share whatever I can, because believe it or not corporate has taken over the industry. Many people/businesses is in it solely for the money, and this, is sad.

Again, thank you all for your input on this thread, even Mr Quotesy, I don't think its illegal to quote anyone? jokes aside. Sincerely thanks to everyone.
You might have missed this earlier...

The best MW claim is 96% and with a 600h, and a continual load graph to show. The drivers get more effecienct with size, no matter the brand. Efficiency is different than power factor, and MW does rate the 110VAC input at a high power factor of 0.98, but residential only pays for real power or kWh so power factor is meaningless to me.

And I'm not upset about Inventronics drivers, I'm not loyal to MW, all I care about is effeciency reliability and price. Inventronics seem to be a good product but I don't see the difference in price you describe from the limited resellers I've seen. Throw some links up where you're getting the cheap inventronics from, if they cost less I'd probably use.

Sometimes different power specs than what MW has available is nice, it looks like they offer higher current CC drivers than MW, as well as a 600W CC which I haven't seen from MW either.
 

Nyaga

Junior Soil Food Web Consultant
You might have missed this earlier...

The best MW claim is 96% and with a 600h, and a continual load graph to show. The drivers get more effecienct with size, no matter the brand. Efficiency is different than power factor, and MW does rate the 110VAC input at a high power factor of 0.98, but residential only pays for real power or kWh so power factor is meaningless to me.

And I'm not upset about Inventronics drivers, I'm not loyal to MW, all I care about is effeciency reliability and price. Inventronics seem to be a good product but I don't see the difference in price you describe from the limited resellers I've seen. Throw some links up where you're getting the cheap inventronics from, if they cost less I'd probably use.

Sometimes different power specs than what MW has available is nice, it looks like they offer higher current CC drivers than MW, as well as a 600W CC which I haven't seen from MW either.
lol I don't know what you need. Do know that powerland = inventronics?
you can email them and ask them for specs and pricing.

For more information, please contact GWP-Powerland North America at 1-310-881-3890 Ext 1 or sales@greenwattpower.com. Sampling for all ICE series models are available upon request.

 

ChiefRunningPhist

Drunk on Knowledge
lol I don't know what you need. Do know that powerland = inventronics?
you can email them and ask them for specs and pricing.

For more information, please contact GWP-Powerland North America at 1-310-881-3890 Ext 1 or sales@greenwattpower.com. Sampling for all ICE series models are available upon request.

Lol

Maybe you called and bought from a rep? What driver? What price? Or were you just pulling shit out your ass when you said that Inventronics was cheaper?

I'm all for alternatives, if they can be had, but would only like to know where you've bought, and the price, because so far you've just been muddying the waters with bad info.

Meanwell doesn't have bad effeciency. Inventronics isn't beating MW in effeciency. Inventronics isn't any cheaper. LM301H isn't any more effecienct than LM301B. Your credibility is pretty low with me atm.

Also, the model you posted needs 240VAC.
 

Nyaga

Junior Soil Food Web Consultant
Lol

Maybe you called and bought from a rep? What driver? What price? Or were you just pulling shit out your ass when you said that Inventronics was cheaper?

I'm all for alternatives, if they can be had, but would only like to know where you've bought, and the price, because so far you've just been muddying the waters with bad info.

Meanwell doesn't have bad effeciency. Inventronics isn't beating MW in effeciency. Inventronics isn't any cheaper. LM301H isn't any more effecienct than LM301B. Your credibility is pretty low with me atm.

Also, the model you posted needs 240VAC.
Look man I have nothing to prove to you by spoon feeding you information, but simply because you cannot find information does not mean someone else can't, i do like your enthusiasm. My credibility with you? :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:

I did not state LM301H is more efficient, I stated it is the same chip as LM301B, and that in my opinion (here I am moving to a different problem in the same sentence i think it was) it is not worth it to jump on every new LED release for 10% improvement in efficacy with 20% higher price generation after generation ( mixed up 2 thoughts in the same breath and because in the beginning i'm saying its basically the same chip, and I am tired thinking of talking about moving from LM561Cs6bin to LM301b or H is not worth the money. That post took long to type I got tired of rereading what i was saying, You've been so excited to share information that you jumble it up and it comes out all wrong? thats what happens to me all the time). I'm not english so fix the grammer yourself if you can not comprehend what I am saying with commas and fullstops. :)

Here you go 97% efficiency + bluetooth dimming
http://www.fsp-powerland.com/Documents/ICE347-640W.pdf


I also did not say or claimed to have bought anything whatsoever, nor am I claiming that I haven't bought anything. My reason for doing that is not to create bias in opinion, simply opening up discussion on the matter.

If you cannot find it cheaper than meanwell you are simply to lazy to look for yourself. This thread or posts is not about pushing certain products over other, it is simply information to take into consideration when you make a selection for your own grow.

Just watch the youtube video I posted man, no need to start drama. I honestly work 16 hour shifts cannot be bothered to do the same amount of research as to when I have free time. just because something is not american, doesn't mean its wrong? I'm sure they have model numbers which have an input range for your voltage range, Anyways peace.
 
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ChiefRunningPhist

Drunk on Knowledge
Look man I have nothing to prove to you by spoon feeding you information, but simply because you cannot find information does not mean someone else can't, i do like your enthusiasm. My credibility with you? :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
That's pathetic, and I'm calling your bluff. The onus isn't on me, its on you. You've yet to provide a single link showing cheaper prices. You talk like you're trying to help the community, so then how about putting your money where your mouth is and providing a link? Where did you come up with the idea that they were cheaper? Did you just pull it out of your butt? You must have bought one before or looked to buy one, so why so secretive about your experience..??? Are you in the CIA?? LMAO because that's how you sound, "can neither confirm nor deny" lol

And yes your credibility is absolute poop. You know what the best kind of lie is? The one that's wrapped in truth. That's exactly what you've been doing.

You stand on your soap box and preach wrong info but wrapped up in some legit info, so to anyone that doesn't know will unsuspectingly believe your poop as fact. You dont make corrections, you don't provide correct info, you just keep pushing Inventronics... and then leave a sales rep phone number to call Lol Hmmm...

I did not state LM301H is more efficient,
Here ya go..
Electrical efficiency is also improved by 10% or less from the LM301b, but costs 20% more
^^Your explanation about this statement in your above post is clearly a lie and a slimy squirm out of accountability. You were clearly talking about lm301h and lm301b. Not impressed...


Here's some more poop you pulled out of nowhere..
Fluence moved away from meanwell driver and now using a different driver (Cheaper more efficient)
Link?? And no, not referring to fluence changing drivers, referring to other drivers being cheaper and more effecienct than mean well, that's an example of a lie wrapped in truth.


And some more...
I would recommend a inventronics driver for the following reasons.
Cheaper than meanwell,
becomes way more efficient than meanwell at higher wattages
can do everything meanwell drivers do in most cases better and cheaper
Link??


And some more poo poo..
Meanwell claim 98% efficiency, whilst its proven more like 92%
Link??


Must have been a big meal...
better off getting inventronics as they are actually more efficient at higher wattage even though they state less.
Link??
^^This one you're actually getting mixed up with MW.


I do not believe it is wrong for meanwell to rate their driver at 98% peak efficiency
Link??
And good, cause they don't...


I hope this answers some questions or correct some statements made.
Yep the question of whether you're full of poop or not.


The more you know the easier you see through the bullshit and marketing campaigns
Oh ya, totally agree, and why I know you how full of poop you are, you can't post a pic of your rig, but love screaming inventronics and falsifying MW data.. Hmmmm... If anything it sounds like you're the one on the marketing campaign...
 

ChiefRunningPhist

Drunk on Knowledge
@Nyaga I'm only looking for confirmation to your claims. Your efficiency data is full of holes and you want to call me lazy when I can't find the cheap prices you screamed about. I was patient about correcting some of your false statements earlier but you keep ramming your head against the wall about Inventronics and not wanting to give any supporting data to back up your claim.

Btw, the inventronics only get to 97% effeciency if 380VAC is used. The data sheets say up to 97% but the load effeciency graphs don't even show 96% effeciency with 277VAC.

MW 600h says 96% but actually shows a bit higher % when 277VAC or 230VAC is used. In this instance, meanwell gives more effeciency than stated, while inventronics gives less than stated. And we still have no clue what they cost, so...
 

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Nyaga

Junior Soil Food Web Consultant
@Nyaga I'm only looking for confirmation to your claims. Your efficiency data is full of holes and you want to call me lazy when I can't find the cheap prices you screamed about. I was patient about correcting some of your false statements earlier but you keep ramming your head against the wall about Inventronics and not wanting to give any supporting data to back up your claim.

Btw, the inventronics only get to 97% effeciency if 380VAC is used. The data sheets say up to 97% but the load effeciency graphs don't even show 96% effeciency with 277VAC.

MW 600h says 96% but actually shows a bit higher % when 277VAC or 230VAC is used. In this instance, meanwell gives more effeciency than stated, while inventronics gives less than stated. And we still have no clue what they cost, so...
you are correct. thank you.
 

DET—PDX

Insanely Active Member
Found a good article comparing blue, red, green, daylight and darkness with THC production.
Blue and red win according the this finding, but that’s the great thing about science and this under studied plant. There are going to be many disagreements, and many different reaearch findings before enough data is compiled to do meta analysis and use statistics to find the relevant information.
 

DET—PDX

Insanely Active Member
Just found another FULL TEXT article. Go and read the piss out of this one, it compares HPS with two different LED’s. So far I’ve read LED Produced more THC and CBD concentrations, but the dry weight of product in HPS is greater. All lights were at 450 umol/s so far and LED’s can deliver higher PAR than that at less cost and in a more condensed size. Wondering what would happen if you had multiple HPS’s and LEDs compared at 900 umol/s?

Edit: as I keep reading, there was discrepancy in dry weight between HPS and the two LED’s. 28.3g/m vs 26.8g/m was not statistically significant.

-HPS THC was 38% less.
-No current data for regulation of THC enzymatic gene expression :(
-Blue light typically increases flavonoids.
-Blue and UV-A light with R:FR in LED’s produced more THC than that of Red-Far Red HPS devoid of UVA-A and blue light. Another study supported this (which I might read next) and is summarized by researchers reporting blue AND red-far red (R:FR) enhances THC production while green was detrimental.
 
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ChiefRunningPhist

Drunk on Knowledge
Just found another FULL TEXT article. Go and read the piss out of this one, it compares HPS with two different LED’s. So far I’ve read LED Produced more THC and CBD concentrations, but the dry weight of product in HPS is greater. All lights were at 450 umol/s so far and LED’s can deliver higher PAR than that at less cost and in a more condensed size. Wondering what would happen if you had multiple HPS’s and LEDs compared at 900 umol/s?

Edit: as I keep reading, there was discrepancy in dry weight between HPS and the two LED’s. 28.3g/m vs 26.8g/m was not statistically significant.

-HPS THC was 38% less.
-No current data for regulation of THC enzymatic gene expression :(
-Blue light typically increases flavonoids.
-Blue and UV-A light with R:FR in LED’s produced more THC than that of Red-Far Red HPS devoid of UVA-A and blue light. Another study supported this (which I might read next) and is summarized by researchers reporting blue AND red-far red (R:FR) enhances THC production while green was detrimental.
Nice find :) it'd be nice to see a study with closer to 900PPFD. According to T. Fujita, around ~425PPFD is where green starts to overtake red in photosynthetic effeciency. I have yet to read the first one you posted, but I'll take a peek. Feel free to throw any good spectrum related research on that thread too.

EDIT:
Lol I see where you were already on the same pg with 900, my bad, skimmed through it and missed it, oops!
 
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Weedkiller

Dazed and confused
I have some hlg respect v2 lm301b,3000k boards at I would trade for seeds. Bought them off ebay with great intention but I found a 240w light off Amazon because meanwell drivers and heatsinks aren't cheap. Anyone interested holler at me. I'd like to see them be of use rather than gather dust.20220713_195232.jpg20220713_195451.jpg
 
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